Lightweight Electric FF concept

This is a project created by Myles Crowder and recently (August 2021) posted on the FF Facebook page. With Myles' permission I am putting it up here. I'm sure Royce Creasey will approve. PNB

Myles explains: "I've got a 72v, 7kWh battery pack being made and a lightweight motor, controller, etc, kit on the way. The battery is going into a pontoon-style chassis and very little needs to be above the (small) wheel-tops. Battery tech is still five years off having range and power without compromising something (like weight, safety, or cost). I'll be relying on the lack of height to give my build viable road speed – 3kW rated with an 11kW peak; effectively a moped with 125 peak power. Call it a proof of concept. While the Luddites baulk at the idea of electrification, it may be an opportunity for a rethink of PTWs. But for acceptance, there will have to be a sense of occasion baked into any design."

The cycle parts will mostly be coming from an Italjet F125 – the 2-stroke twin scooter with hub centre steering, that came out in 2001.

FWIW, my own experience with 11kW/15bhp learner-legal scooters leads me to believe that an 11kW electric FF with half-decent aerodynamics should easily be able to achieve 80mph, probably more. For reference and comparison, the original 125cc 4-stroke BMW C1, rated at 11kW/15bhp was actually capable of a genuine 70mph, as recorded on my GPS when I rode one down to the Beaulieu motorcycle show in 2000, despite its very high roof and humungous 185kg/407lb dry weight (over 200kg wet!).
There's a unique photo of that C1 alongside two other roofed scooters (a Benelli Adiva and the Bubble Gilera Runner) facing Mark Crowson's white Quasar here: PNB

Image: © Myles Crowder

Lightweight Electric FF concept

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Of Course!

Do I approve? Of course. Although I hope no-one spends time seeking the approval of an old fart like me! It's basically a CE04-beater, see my comment elswhere. Obviously there's a long way to go from this vapourware to a running machine but it looks like a perfectly reasonable start point.

I'm hugely encouraged by the number of people who've picked up the challenge of creating an E-FF, accepting the packaging challenge, the current battery limitations and grasping power electronics. I fully expect to be overtaken by yournger, more energetic youngsters in getting an E-ff on the road. My target is five years, when E5 petrol is replaced by E10 and FJ becomes functionally obsolete. I expect better battery tech to be availalbe by then, with more people making better custom packs. Although really I'd like to take a BMW E-bike and convert it (see 'gnashing of teeth in Muchen' elsewhere). BMW, of all people have got it coming.

As one of the older FF farts, I'd liie to make clear to one-off builders that I'm very happy to discuss any FF design feature. Obviously you can all do better than anything done in the past, although I may be able to help dodge some of the bullets.

Perdix's picture

A little update on this.

The battery is on test and should be shipping very shortly.
I had spec'd a maximum size as 680x280x150. Usefully, the as-built size is a significantly smaller 500x280x135.

Battery Testing

As a slight step sideways, this will be repurposing the frame from an Italjet scooter. This is partly because it will be helpful in greasing the wheels of legality and (not insignificantly) because most of the connecting bits are already in the right locations. The pontoon arrangement will be staying.
Front suspension was a little bit of a surprise (although it answered a long-outstanding question). It transpires that the HCS front end of the scooters are less ELFe and rather more Reliant.
It had never made much sense as to how the linkage betwixt wheel and bars controlled the axial orientation of the hub - the hub would be flopping around on a ball joint. And this is because it doesn't.
The front hub is a simple kingpin arrangement and all the load is taken by the (steel) swingarm. This simplifies lowering the front end and re-arranging the steering.
The simplification comes at the cost of control over geometry. But in previous conversations with Tony Foale, this wasn't seen as overly problematic and the continued use on the new-ish Italjet Dragster seems to support this.

I was going to nickname the project "6060", for a real-world 60 mile range and 60mph.
I think that it might have been given a new name now "Vapore" and agree with Royce. It's only real when you can ride it.

Onwards and sideways!